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Rush0212

2017 Blow Mold Gifts!!!

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Rush0212    43

Well it happen again, I was just totally floored yet again, by the kindness of people, and blessed with more new blow mold gifts!!

A couple of weeks ago, someone I know called me , and told me she was cleaning out moms attic, and really wanted me to have them!!

Heres a pic of the overall ones, look at the work her dad put into them 50 years ago, abd the shape of them I cant get over how new the empire deers look after this long!!

 

2017-06-22_133240.jpg.ae20d2628365e50256ffadf1889cc7f0.jpg

Heres the ones that stump me  Ive never seen these deer, sleigh, or santa before, theres only numbers n them no markings, and they have noraml 60 watt bulbs in each, with custom wiring, but no sockets, and need to be rewired. I still cant even get over it, and what floors me more is how many I was given last year, I mean shocking!

2017-06-22_133313.jpg.1d1e1dbd4641d6883e5e2227af50801a.jpg

BTW I see my pics were too large before risizing them for this thread, [Thanks qberg!] Anyone have any idea how large i can make the pics by any chance?

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donna123    105

Congrats on all of them!

I think the Deer and the Santa are made by Beco.  Wow, what a lucky day for you!

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45 minutes ago, donna123 said:

Congrats on all of them!

I think the Deer and the Santa are made by Beco.  Wow, what a lucky day for you!

Donna if it only it were that easy.  Those particular deer were made by beco originally, a company called MSL after they acquired the molds, and the general foam in the early seventies.  There has always been discussion about this confusing topic here on PCF, and I think there are several old threads (just type MSL in the search engine at the top and you should see). We know that the only true ID is printed on the boxes, but it is possible to determine the producer by the plastic quality.  I hear (this is a short explanation from several years of research) that the beco ones are thin and fragile, the MSL ones are even more so, almost celluloid like, and the GF ones are usual quality.  However this doesn't determine anything because of different  things like blow mold condition or quality of a particular plastic batch.  If you want to try figuring it out go ahead :) .

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donna123    105
7 hours ago, The Blow Mold Expert said:

Donna if it only it were that easy.  Those particular deer were made by beco originally, a company called MSL after they acquired the molds, and the general foam in the early seventies.  There has always been discussion about this confusing topic here on PCF, and I think there are several old threads (just type MSL in the search engine at the top and you should see). We know that the only true ID is printed on the boxes, but it is possible to determine the producer by the plastic quality.  I hear (this is a short explanation from several years of research) that the beco ones are thin and fragile, the MSL ones are even more so, almost celluloid like, and the GF ones are usual quality.  However this doesn't determine anything because of different  things like blow mold condition or quality of a particular plastic batch.  If you want to try figuring it out go ahead :) .

That's ok......I'll leave that to you guys!  Since there doesn't look like there are any boxes I guess Rush will never know for sure.  

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Allen L.    104

Wow!!!! Talk about being lucky.  Your fortune cookie must have said "Big Surprise Headed Your Way".  Awesome!

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Rush0212    43

Thanks all, for all, the compliments!! Yeh I'm totally pysced about them!!!

About these deer, and Santa, they are a normal blow mold plastic not fragile, but the sleigh, is totally thin, and cracked/cracking.

They actually were all made with light bulbs, and have a really weird socket, will try to take pics of them tomorrow , the reindeer heads come off, and there's a bulb in each. The Santa has the same bulb, and the only writing on it says "Item no 988 120v"

I will have to rewire them all, as the wires are dry roted, and all the male sockets were cut off, looks like they were wired to a controller of some type. I'll also  see about using c-9, instead of normal, and see which looks better.

Edited by Rush0212
typo/add

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Mel Fischer    296
22 hours ago, donna123 said:

Here is a pic....

 

image.jpeg

Donna, this picture can lead to a bit more confusion with the reindeer.  The caption with the picture was added to the picture by someone, it was not with the original picture.  The picture came from the 1966 Sears Christmas catalog.  Also, the reindeer and sleigh did first appear in a Sears catalog in 1966 but that was not the first year for them, we have a pair of the Beco reindeer in their original box that is dated 9/23/64.  We also have a pair of the MSL reindeer in their original box that is dated 7-10-68.

Here is the page from the Sears catalog.

Mel

Sears Catalog 1966s Page 382.jpg

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Mel Fischer    296
16 hours ago, donna123 said:

That's ok......I'll leave that to you guys!  Since there doesn't look like there are any boxes I guess Rush will never know for sure.  

Donna, he might have a possibility of finding out who made them, as I recall the Beco reindeer have the Beco name molded into them on the bottom but to verify that I would need to get ours out and that would be a somewhat big project they are in the building up between the trusses in their box and I would need to move 40-50 blow molds to be able to put up a ladder to get them down and check them.  I located a thread from July 2011 with a discussion on the Beco/MSL/General Foam reindeer I started that you might enjoy looking through, my second post in the thread gives the differences I found in the three companies reindeer at the time.  As I stated above we have a pair of the Beco reindeer in their original box and we also have two pair of MSL reindeer in the original boxes and two pair of General Foam Plastics reindeer in their original boxes that I used for comparison along with several pictures and descriptions from others who have them.

https://forums.planetchristmas.com/index.php?/topic/47385-msl-santa-sleigh-reindeer-ebay-auction/

Mel

 

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TED    98
On 8/6/2017 at 10:09 PM, Rush0212 said:

Well it happen again, I was just totally floored yet again, by the kindness of people, and blessed with more new blow mold gifts!!

A couple of weeks ago, someone I know called me , and told me she was cleaning out moms attic, and really wanted me to have them!!

Heres a pic of the overall ones, look at the work her dad put into them 50 years ago, abd the shape of them I cant get over how new the empire deers look after this long!!

Heres the ones that stump me  Ive never seen these deer, sleigh, or santa before, theres only numbers n them no markings, and they have noraml 60 watt bulbs in each, with custom wiring, but no sockets, and need to be rewired.

Wow!  Congratulations!!  It's obvious that the previous owner took great care of them.  (I like the way he built those stands for the reindeer.)  It's great that they have been passed on to someone else who will appreciate them!

6 hours ago, Rush0212 said:

They actually were all made with light bulbs, and have a really weird socket, will try to take pics of them tomorrow , the reindeer heads come off, and there's a bulb in each. The Santa has the same bulb, and the only writing on it says "Item no 988 120v"

I will have to rewire them all, as the wires are dry roted, and all the male sockets were cut off, looks like they were wired to a controller of some type. I'll also  see about using c-9, instead of normal, and see which looks better.

It's a wonder that the 60 watt bulbs didn't damage (or melt) the deer.  I'd definitely go with some lower wattage bulbs.  I think you'd be making it hard on yourself to use C9 bulbs.  If there's a way to use the C7 cordsets that would make things easier.  Please take some pictures of the original light setup.  I'm sure I'm not the only one who would enjoy seeing how it was originally done!

TED

Edited by TED
to repair some cords!

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donna123    105
6 hours ago, Mel Fischer said:

Donna, he might have a possibility of finding out who made them, as I recall the Beco reindeer have the Beco name molded into them on the bottom but to verify that I would need to get ours out and that would be a somewhat big project they are in the building up between the trusses in their box and I would need to move 40-50 blow molds to be able to put up a ladder to get them down and check them.  I located a thread from July 2011 with a discussion on the Beco/MSL/General Foam reindeer I started that you might enjoy looking through, my second post in the thread gives the differences I found in the three companies reindeer at the time.  As I stated above we have a pair of the Beco reindeer in their original box and we also have two pair of MSL reindeer in the original boxes and two pair of General Foam Plastics reindeer in their original boxes that I used for comparison along with several pictures and descriptions from others who have them.

https://forums.planetchristmas.com/index.php?/topic/47385-msl-santa-sleigh-reindeer-ebay-auction/

Mel

 

Thanks Mel, it was interesting to read and I wish Photobucket wasn't blocking your pics.  I had no idea that these deer stirred such indepth conversations going back years.

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13 hours ago, Mel Fischer said:

Donna, he might have a possibility of finding out who made them, as I recall the Beco reindeer have the Beco name molded into them on the bottom but to verify that I would need to get ours out and that would be a somewhat big project they are in the building up between the trusses in their box and I would need to move 40-50 blow molds to be able to put up a ladder to get them down and check them.  I located a thread from July 2011 with a discussion on the Beco/MSL/General Foam reindeer I started that you might enjoy looking through, my second post in the thread gives the differences I found in the three companies reindeer at the time.  As I stated above we have a pair of the Beco reindeer in their original box and we also have two pair of MSL reindeer in the original boxes and two pair of General Foam Plastics reindeer in their original boxes that I used for comparison along with several pictures and descriptions from others who have them.

https://forums.planetchristmas.com/index.php?/topic/47385-msl-santa-sleigh-reindeer-ebay-auction/

Mel

 

If that's true, that the beco deer say beco (which I think they do), then it is likely that rush has GF deer. The MSL ones were paper thin and the beco ones may have had markings, so normal thickness deer with no markings except for numbers are most Like General Foam. Just an educated guess there are too many variables to know for sure.

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Rush0212    43

WOW, Thanks all for the info, and compliments!!!

Mel, Thanks so much, I will definetley read that link that you posted, and please don't go through all that trouble, I will look more into, it.

 

Ted I haven't had the time to come here in a couple of days, but I promise Ill try to take pics tomorrow , and yes they do the reindeer, and santa both have 60 watt  bulbs in them, and I meant to say I'll try c-7's for sure, I mean since their white, I think it will be more than enough, and Im going to put them on a chasing controller, like the original owner did!!!

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TED    98
On 8/11/2017 at 8:56 PM, Rush0212 said:

Ted I haven't had the time to come here in a couple of days, but I promise Ill try to take pics tomorrow , and yes they do the reindeer, and santa both have 60 watt  bulbs in them, and I meant to say I'll try c-7's for sure, I mean since their white, I think it will be more than enough, and Im going to put them on a chasing controller, like the original owner did!!!

If you do find that the standard C7 bulbs aren't bright enough there are many other types of bulbs with the same candelabra size base that will fit the C7 cordsets.  Even if you have to find different bulbs for the C7 cords it will still be easier than using C9s because you won't have to cut up a C9 cord, wire up plugs, and figure out how to build some kind of mounting bracket.

TED

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Rush0212    43

WOW after reading the other threads about these, I don't know, I didn't even know about the company MSL until this thread! I would've guessed it was theirs only because Beco would've had their name on it, and I thought GF would always  had it on there, but who knows!!

Heres a couple of pics of the lights, i the deer, the Santa has the same exact bulb holder knob thingy:

2017-08-12_193055.jpg.f7917c4fefc2a298cb82ddeca8d276c2.jpg

2017-08-12_193203.jpg.73ae98b242861b19fb7017a510b3b1be.jpg

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Mel Fischer    296

Those are either MSL or General Foam and looking at the plastic in the first picture I think that they are probably MSL.  Also, those are original light cords both MSL and General Foam used that kind of lighting in some of the Beco molds.  This is the back of the General Foam #C975 Santa made from the Beco #975 mold showing the white knob that attaches the lighting setup.

Mel

General Foam Plastics Santa  (Back) (#C975).jpg

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5 minutes ago, Mel Fischer said:

Those are either MSL or General Foam and looking at the plastic in the first picture I think that they are probably MSL.  Also, those are original light cords both MSL and General Foam used that kind of lighting in some of the Beco molds.  This is the back of the General Foam #C975 Santa made from the Beco #975 mold showing the white knob that attaches the lighting setup.

Mel

General Foam Plastics Santa  (Back) (#C975).jpg

The plastic seems much too thick to me to be MSL. MSL plastic I've seen is less glossy and far more brittle. That looks thin yet durable, and very glossy which is still common with general foam molds to this day. Those deer are probably General Foam, but it is very hard to tell for sure.

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Mel Fischer    296

I will try to go out to the building tomorrow and get our MSL and General Foam reindeer out and compare them.  We have two pair of each.

Mel

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shane page    89

I have some molds with that style of light and they are general foam and beco. How many manufacturers made the sleigh? Maybe there is a mark on that and I would think whoever bought the deer would have got it all at the same time like the picture in the add shows. The santa looks like it could be beco.

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shane page    89
On 8/7/2017 at 10:28 PM, Rush0212 said:

Thanks all, for all, the compliments!! Yeh I'm totally pysced about them!!!

About these deer, and Santa, they are a normal blow mold plastic not fragile, but the sleigh, is totally thin, and cracked/cracking.

They actually were all made with light bulbs, and have a really weird socket, will try to take pics of them tomorrow , the reindeer heads come off, and there's a bulb in each. The Santa has the same bulb, and the only writing on it says "Item no 988 120v"

I will have to rewire them all, as the wires are dry roted, and all the male sockets were cut off, looks like they were wired to a controller of some type. I'll also  see about using c-9, instead of normal, and see which looks better.

#988 is the Beco jolly santa. I suppose others could have left that on there if they were using the Beco mold. 

Edited by shane page

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12 minutes ago, shane page said:

#988 is the Beco jolly santa. I suppose others could have left that on there if they were using the Beco mold. 

I believe the beco ones also say "beco - #988", and the GF ones just say "#988". GF bought all the beco molds and it probably would have been easier to just keep all the cereal numbers.

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Mel Fischer    296
1 hour ago, The Blow Mold Expert said:

I believe the beco ones also say "beco - #988", and the GF ones just say "#988". GF bought all the beco molds and it probably would have been easier to just keep all the cereal numbers.

Yes, General Foam did keep the Beco numbers and added a 'C' in front of the number.  MSL just kept the Beco number.  Here are two of the pictures that were originally in the link that I posted above.  The first one is the original General Foam and MSL Plastics boxes showing the catalog numbers for the reindeer the second one shows the MSL original boxes from 1968.

Mel

BecoGenFoamReindeerBoxes1000.jpg

491535600_o.jpg

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